New-born Baby's Cans: Making Money in a Down Market

[New-born baby]

Heads Up

Investors,

Today is the last day to buy to get the dividend. But I wouldn't buy anything today. The reason is: the units will be two or three months' worth of dividends cheaper tomorrow. These trusts generally drop on the ex-date about 2-3 dividend's worth right after open. That is a great time to buy. Then by next month, prices rebound.

Here's todays prices on some good trusts:

PMT--17.58 CD last months low was 14.90, dividend is .22
AE--last month's low was 14.00, today 15.46. dividend=.1625 nice move!
AY--11.94 last month's low was 11.55 dividend=.16

I suggest you buy after perhaps tomorrow within 25 minutes of the open, and then hang on.

[Thomrich]

greetings,
If im not mistaken the units must be held till the record date which is usually 2 days post EX,

cordially Tom

[New-born baby]

to get the dividend

Tom

You are correct. IF one buys a stock on the ex-date or thereafter, he does NOT get the dividend. IF one buys a stock before the ex-date, he must hold through the record date or he does NOT get the dividend.

For example. PMT January 27 is ex-date. January 31 is record date. In order to get the divy one would have to purchase the stock before Jan. 27 and not sell it before Feb 1.

I think the best time to buy these cans is on the ex-date through the record date. You lose that month's dividend, but you can usually purchase them much cheaper, for about 2-3 months worth of dividends less.

[spikefader]

New-born.
Thanks for a great thread. I'm learning lots. Best to ya.

[New-born baby]

Fdg

Investors:

FDG, Fording Coal Trust, is a stock you might consider for a long. The speculation is that FDG is going to raise the dividend from 1.057 per quarter to $2. If that happens, FDG is going to move up from $77 today to $125 or even $150 per unit. If you watch FDG, you will note that:

1. It does down on big green Dow days.
2. The next day it bounces up $1 or more.
3. This makes this baby a nice swingtrade!
4. One of these days it is going to bounce and stay up there, provided the divy is raised.

One nice thing about these Cans: if the price drops, the divy makes a nice comforter until it bounces again.

Lastly, $75 is a lot of money per share, but, as Wm. O'Neill says, "What does Sammy Sosa make? Star athletes make more money than utility players. The same with stocks."

[New-born baby]

I can't believe it!

New-born.
Thanks for a great thread. I'm learning lots. Best to ya.

Spike,

Thank you, but I can't believe I could teach the master anything. You have too much experience and knowledge for that.

[df21084]

Investors:

FDG, Fording Coal Trust, is a stock you might consider for a long.

Hi there New-born,

I see FDG on the NYSE, and I see FDG.UN on the TSX. Are these the same company? When I look at Yahoo Finance, there's quite a price variance.

FDG = Fording Canadian Coal Trust, currently at $76.66.
FDG.UN = Fording Inc., currently at 94.50.


Sorry ... but I confuse easily.

[New-born baby]

fdg

dfXXXXX

$96 in Canadian money is $96 X current exchange rate of .815955= $78.33 US dollars. So they are priced about the same. Don't forget the exchange rate.

Hey, you bought some AY.UN didn't you? You have some price appreciation, too, don't you? AY is a good company and will grow.

[df21084]

dfXXXXX

$96 in Canadian money is $96 X current exchange rate of .815955= $78.33 US dollars. So they are priced about the same. Don't forget the exchange rate.

Hey, you bought some AY.UN didn't you? You have some price appreciation, too, don't you? AY is a good company and will grow.

I haven't bought any yet. I was waiting until the xdate in hopes the price would drop about 2 months worth of dividends. I'll probably buy on Thursday or Friday.

I'm still looking for another broker (I think). I like Scottrade because I don't have much money. I think their commissions are reasonable, but I can't stand the fact that Scottrade doesn't have a dividend reinvestment plan.

BTW ... BPT hit $53.00 today. It closed at $52.97.

[Karel]

I was looking a bit at the Cans and wondered if some actually have US tickers. They seem to trade on the Nasdaq:NM / Other OTC
PMT.UN = PMGYF
AY.UN = APFRF?
AE.UN = ACNJF
NVG.UN = NVGUF?
BTE.UN = BAYXF?
AVN.UN = AVNNF?
BNP.UN = BNPUF?
VKR.UN = VKERF?

bonterra:
BNE.UN = BNEUF?

Is that right? Could be easier than going the Canada way.

Regards,

Karel

[df21084]

... AY.UN = APFRF?

Is that right? Could be easier than going the Canada way.

I received the prospectus of APF Energy Unit Trust, and it stated it is available on the Toronto stock exchange. No mention was made regarding US exchanges.

Yahoo! Finance doesn't show APFRF as paying any dividend / distribution. It is very confusing.

Hopefully New-born can shed some light.

[New-born baby]

Depends . . . .

Karel, DFxxxxx,

You can buy these Cans on the US side via pink sheets if you have Ameritrade as your broker. If not, you must buy on the TSX. Earlier in the thread I pointed out that this was the case. I myself have Scottrade, so I have to call my broker, and he buys on the TSX for me. Ameritrade is a big hassle as it does not provide streaming quotes. It is pure guess work. The best way to go is Interactive Brokers, and get the streaming TSX quotes. Then you can buy and sell these babies for just .02 per share Canadian.

Karel,
The symbols you listed are pink sheet symbols, and yes, you can buy them with those symbols the Ameritrade way.

The advantage of having an Interactive Brokers account is that your American dollar is actually in another country. The US dollar is getting weaker by the day, because the US govt continues to print them. China holds $600 Billion in a bank in Beijing, and if (I mean, WHEN) they decide to wreck the US economy, they will simply dump them on the currency exchange, and we will have hyper-inflation, hyper-interest rates, unemployment, a banking collapse, etc. (I say this believing that China is not a friend of the USA).

[spikefader]

Spike,

Thank you, but I can't believe I could teach the master anything. You have too much experience and knowledge for that.

Oh I ain't no master! Just a monkey at the wheel

Actually, my knowledge of fundamentals and 'investment' in the pure sense of the word is probably only as much as Joe Six-pack....maybe not even that much, which is why this thread rocks. It really nails down on some understandable specifics, is real simple to comprehend, and highlights a very tradeable entry and exit criteria that makes sense. CANs seem a great way to have a hedged position that will perform well in times that stocks are so vulnerable. Had you not posted about it, I'd still be in the dark with all the other mushrooms Thanks for sharin'.

[Gatorman]

Karel, DFxxxxx,

You can buy these Cans on the US side via pink sheets if you have Ameritrade as your broker. If not, you must buy on the TSX. Earlier in the thread I pointed out that this was the case. I myself have Scottrade, so I have to call my broker, and he buys on the TSX for me. Ameritrade is a big hassle as it does not provide streaming quotes. It is pure guess work. The best way to go is Interactive Brokers, and get the streaming TSX quotes. Then you can buy and sell these babies for just .02 per share Canadian.

Karel,
The symbols you listed are pink sheet symbols, and yes, you can buy them with those symbols the Ameritrade way.

The advantage of having an Interactive Brokers account is that your American dollar is actually in another country. The US dollar is getting weaker by the day, because the US govt continues to print them. China holds $600 Billion in a bank in Beijing, and if (I mean, WHEN) they decide to wreck the US economy, they will simply dump them on the currency exchange, and we will have hyper-inflation, hyper-interest rates, unemployment, a banking collapse, etc. (I say this believing that China is not a friend of the USA).

New-born:
From what I previously read on this thread, I have been doing a little DD on CANS with the idea of investing.
Using the pink sheet symbols(PMGYF,APFRF,ACNJF,NVGUF,BAYXF,AVNNF,BNPUF, VKERF,BNEUF)listed above, I checked my on-line brokerage account at E-Trade and would seem to have no problem puchasing any of these. I cannot, however, get streaming quotes for them.
This would lead me to believe they can be purchased at other U.S. on-line brokers. I don't understand why purchase would be limited to Ameritrade.
What am I missing here? Perhaps others with E-Trade accounts can verify what I think to be correct or perhaps you can clarify this for me.
Thanks for your help and comments on what appears to be a safer haven during these trying times.

[New-born baby]

You're not missin' a thing

Gator,

What is missing is my knowledge of E-trade. I do not have experience with every brokerage firm out there; just Ameritrade, Scottrade and Interactive Brokers. That is why my information is incomplete.

My understanding--remember, it is an incomplete understanding of brokerage firms--is that when you buy these via pink sheets, you cannot get streaming quotes. The reason: they are purchased manually. Human interaction. That is my understanding. Please correct me if I am wrong.

These are great safe havens as long as the demand for oil remains. I think that will be awhile yet.

Suggestion: what AE.UN or whatever Acclaim Energy Trust's symbol is on the pink sheet. If you can get her to bounce down to 14.50 CD (that would be 1.75 or less US), I'd buy it up as fast as I could.